tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2571993804128797898.post5556682370651000632..comments2021-10-30T14:01:39.333-05:00Comments on Pickled Eggs - The Word Dwelling Richly: The Manhattan DeclarationJason Poquettehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00986920189631928938noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2571993804128797898.post-2747267819070902132009-12-08T21:07:40.197-05:002009-12-08T21:07:40.197-05:00Amen to the hymn quoted ...
"All other ground...Amen to the hymn quoted ...<br />"All other ground is sinking sand."Bevhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08851173450391330942noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2571993804128797898.post-52976815278224413112009-12-08T20:29:29.321-05:002009-12-08T20:29:29.321-05:00Hi Bev,
R.C. expresses my concerns better than I ...Hi Bev,<br /><br />R.C. expresses my concerns better than I ever could myself, and has many more additional insights. Great link!<br /><br />Michael Horton has this statement also:<br /><br />http://www.whitehorseinn.org/archives/250.html<br /><br />I hope, as RC says, that some of the previous signers will have the courage to withdraw their names. <br /><br />All that said, my heart still weeps over these sins which our nation defends, not to mention all my own sins which, were they weighed out, would be more than enough to sink our country to the bottom of the deep blue sea. <br /><br />Our hope is built on NOTHING less than Jesus blood and righteousness!<br /><br />JasonJason Poquettehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00986920189631928938noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2571993804128797898.post-51367487886831304802009-12-08T19:14:52.284-05:002009-12-08T19:14:52.284-05:00Hi, Jason ... Have you seen this?
(Not sure how to...Hi, Jason ... Have you seen this?<br />(Not sure how to make it a live link, so it will have to be copied and pasted into your browser.)<br /><br />http://new.ligonier.org/blog/the-manhattan-declaration/<br /><br />Still thinking about all this ... appreciate your thoughtful comments.Bevhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08851173450391330942noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2571993804128797898.post-57371590813344348122009-12-02T17:46:25.390-05:002009-12-02T17:46:25.390-05:00Terry,
Well stated! Those texts are very appropr...Terry,<br /><br />Well stated! Those texts are very appropriate, as well as many others that come to mind....<br /><br />Sincerely,<br />JasonJason Poquettehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00986920189631928938noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2571993804128797898.post-9226265185631785022009-12-02T17:07:21.174-05:002009-12-02T17:07:21.174-05:00Well done Jason! I have yet to see any proponents ...Well done Jason! I have yet to see any proponents of TMD explain what they believe 2Cor.6:14-16 to mean. "Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness? What harmony is there between Christ and Belial? What does a believer have in common with an unbeliever? What agreement is there between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God". If my understanding is correct, the TMD claims every religious leader signing this document is a brother/sister in Christ(Christian)regardless of which Gospel they believe. Those in Christ who understand that this is impossible, in reality, have committed the highest treason by afixing their names to a lie....IN HIS NAME! And all in hopes of creating a better world? Methinks Proverbs 16:25 addresses mans best intentions: "There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end it leads to death."<br />If John Macarthur is the last man standing for the truth he will still stand! I thank God he's not alone and may He have mercy on us all!Terryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00525491602192523568noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2571993804128797898.post-36882070654865278972009-12-01T17:20:41.147-05:002009-12-01T17:20:41.147-05:00Hi MK,
I appreciate your perspective. There are ...Hi MK,<br /><br />I appreciate your perspective. There are men of far greater talents and gifts than I on both sides of this issue right now. I think the weight (if one can so speak) still rests with the "nay" rather than the "yay" (at least within the Reformed camp). Another bit to chew on was offered by Dan Phllips here: http://teampyro.blogspot.com/2009/11/nineteen-questions-for-signers-of.html. <br /><br />But it is still early in the discussion. I'm currently reading David Wells book "The courage to be Protestant." This only confirms my own convictions on this issue. <br /><br />Blessings,<br />JasonJason Poquettehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00986920189631928938noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2571993804128797898.post-91610840382922232392009-12-01T16:26:31.671-05:002009-12-01T16:26:31.671-05:00Enjoyed reading your thoughts, Jason, although, as...Enjoyed reading your thoughts, Jason, although, as you know, I don't agree. Like your other commenters, I don't see this document as a church declaration. When it states that it's from individuals, I choose to believe it. If I do believe that there can be sincere Christians in those 2 churches, I don't know why I can't also concede that the signers might be those very brothers and sisters. I do find the words "sin" and "immorality" in the document; I don't feel they are escaping those words, so much as making efforts at the peace in Christ's church. There will always be tension between the desired peace and desired purity of the church; that tension is played out in this situation.<br />I'd add that other much-loved documents also don't contain clear statements of the gospel & atonement by Christ's blood; the Apostle's Creed comes to mind. I agree with the previous poster, that precisely BECAUSE the document makes no pretense of unifying the 3 churches on precise theological issues, signers have more freedom to participate in the document. They sign as individuals. They are Christians as individuals; thus they understand the gospel. I don't see the problem.M.K.https://www.blogger.com/profile/09205619221345704689noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2571993804128797898.post-62625261090911816122009-11-26T10:24:39.714-05:002009-11-26T10:24:39.714-05:00Dear "Truth Unites and Divides",
Thanks...Dear "Truth Unites and Divides",<br /><br />Thanks for your thoughtful response. It was clear this would be an issue on which good men would disagree. I have removed Ligon Duncans name. I appreciate your comments.<br /><br />Dear Jay,<br /><br />There are many ways. Personally we have labored with Abortion option organizations and my family has opened our doors to do foster care. We promoted activity against legislation that would legalize homosexual marriage. But first and foremost is, as I mention in the article, the focus on faithful expository preaching of the Word of God and presenting the gospel. I believe, in spite of statements to the contrary, that it is a "church confession." They have deliberately framed it as "Catholic, Orthodox & Evangelical" and have not included many other groups who would also agree on the points they address. But men of far greater ability than me have obviously seen it otherwise. I would not want to see differences on this to divide otherwise agreeing brethren. The Lord sanctifies our understanding at different rates, and we must patiently accept His Sovereign plan in this. To God Be the Glory!Jason Poquettehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00986920189631928938noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2571993804128797898.post-9873101411155486712009-11-26T10:09:53.514-05:002009-11-26T10:09:53.514-05:00So here is my question to you Jason:
What declara...So here is my question to you Jason:<br /><br />What declaration or steps has your church taken to make it known that Christians who resist the current immoral laws regarding abortion, homosexuality and religion are in the right?<br /><br />The Manhattan Declaration is signed by some of the same people (Church Colson being one) who signed Evangelicals and Catholics Together.<br /><br />The main difference is that there is NO discussion in the MD about the doctrine of salvation. That was the bone of contention with the ECT. It said that both Catholics and Protestant believe in justification by faith. True. But only Protestants and Eastern Orthodox believe it is by faith ALONE. <br /><br />(However, the Orthodox Church denies imputed sin and imputed righteousness, something the Roman Catholic church confirms.)<br /><br />Protestants can sign the Manhattan Declaration simply because it says nothing about Roman Catholics being orthodox on the doctrine of salvation. <br /><br />A more concerning problem ought to be Dr. Martin Luther King being used as an exemplar, a man who apparently denied the full divinity of Jesus. But even here it is the example of King's actions that are being appealed to, not his orthodoxy.<br /><br />The document does not ask people who sign it to agree that either the committee, the other signers or the examples contained therein are orthodox.<br /><br />In fact, it's not really a church confession, but a declaration by individuals.<br /><br />What is needed now is for individual churches and denominations who cannot sign on this to do something similar.Jay Rogershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14554784180045286033noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2571993804128797898.post-86474016827069361562009-11-26T09:51:46.876-05:002009-11-26T09:51:46.876-05:00Dear Jason,
You have presented the side opposing ...Dear Jason,<br /><br />You have presented the side opposing the Manhattan Declaration very well. It's quite apparent that you have put a lot of thought into it.<br /><br />Although I joyfully signed the Manhattan Declaration and ultimately don't find your arguments persuasive enough (arguments which I had already considered), I do appreciate the thoughtfulness of your decision. <br /><br />By the way, you can take Ligon Duncan's name off your list of those who didn't sign the Manhattan Declaration. He signed it. And I'm reasonably sure that he considered all the problems that you wrote about before he signed and supported the Manhattan Declaration.Truth Unites... and Divideshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08891402278361538353noreply@blogger.com